Posting because these are most likely to be the changes that are going to be shipped out with WotLK!
* Seal of Light now has a chance to heal for [ 15% of AP + 15% of Spell Power ]. (Down from [ 28% of AP + 28% of Spell Power ])
* Seal of Light now deals [ 16% of AP + 25% of Spell Power + 1 ] (down from [ 20% of AP + 32% of Spell Power + 1 ]) holy damage when unleashed.
* Seal of Righteousness now grants each melee attack [ 2.2% of Melee Weapon Speed * AP + 4.4% of Melee Weapon Speed * Spell Power ] additional Holy damage. (Down from [ 2.8% of Melee Weapon Speed * AP + 5.5% of Melee Weapon Speed * Spell Power ])
Protection
* Seal of Justice now deals [ 16% of AP + 25% of Spell Power + 1 ] holy damage when unleashed. (Down from [ 20% of AP + 32% of Spell Power + 1 ])
Retribution
* Judgement of Command Holy damage reduced from 56% to 45%.
* Blessing of Might (Rank 8 ) and Greater Blessing of Might (Rank 3) now increase AP by 306. (Up from 305)
* Seal of Corruption now deals [ 15% of AP + 8.8% of Spell Power ] additional holy damage over 15 seconds. (Down from [ 19.2% of AP + 9.6% of Spell Power ])
* Seal of Corruption now deals [ 14% of AP + 22% of Spell Power + 1 ] Holy damage. (Down from [ 17.5% of AP + 28% of Spell Power + 1 ])
* Seal of the Martyr now make all your melee attacks deal [ 22% of mw ] to [ 22% of MW ]. (Down from [ 28% of mw ] to [ 28% of MW ])
* Seal of the Martyr now deals [ 16% of AP + 25% of Spell Power + 36% of mw ] to [ 16% of AP + 25% of Spell Power + 36% of MW ] Holy Damage when unleashed. (Old - [ 20% of AP + 32% of Spell Power + 25% of mw ] to [ 20% of AP + 32% of Spell Power + 25% of MW ] Holy damage)
* Seal of Blood now make all your melee attacks deal [ 22% of mw ] to [ 22% of MW ]. (Down from [ 28% of mw ] to [ 28% of MW ])
* Seal of Blood now deals [ 16% of AP + 25% of Spell Power + 36% of mw ] to [ 16% of AP + 25% of Spell Power + 36% of MW ] Holy Damage when unleashed. (Old - [ 20% of AP + 32% of Spell Power + 25% of mw ] to [ 20% of AP + 32% of Spell Power + 25% of MW ] Holy damage)
* Seal of Vengeance now deals [ 15% of AP + 8.8% of Spell Power ] additional Holy damage over 15 sec. (Down from [ 19.2% of AP + 9.6% of Spell Power ])
* Seal of Vengeance now deals [ 14% of AP + 22% of Spell Power + 1 ] Holy damage. (Down from [ 17.5% of AP + 28% of Spell Power + 1 ])
* Judgement of Wisdom now restores 1% of the attacker’s maximum mana. (Down from 2%)
* Judgement of Light now has a chance to heal the attacker for [ 10% of AP + 10% of Spell Power ]. (Down from [ 18% of AP + 18% of Spell Power ])
Talents
Retribution
* Divine Storm doesn’t deal Holy damage anymore. Now heals up to 3 party or raid members for 25% of the damage caused. (Up from 20%)
* Righteous Vengeance changed to - When your Judgement and Divine Storm spells deal a critical strike, your target will take 8/16/24/32/40% additional damage over 8 sec.
* The Art of War now increases the damage of Judgement, Crusader Strike and Divine Storm by 5/10%. (Old - Increased critical strike damage only, by 10/20%)
* Judgement of the Wise now grants the paladin 15% of his base mana. (Down from 33%)
* Seal of Command now deals [ 16% of AP + 25% of Spell Power + 24% of mw ] to [ 16% of AP + 25% of Spell Power + 24% of MW ] Holy damage. (Down from [ 20% of AP + 32% of Spell Power + 30% of mw ] to [ 20% of AP + 32% of Spell Power + 30% of MW ])
TL;DR Version :
*Almost all judgements / seals do less damage. Martyr and Blood got a slight judge damage buff.
*Divine Storm = Physical damage, heals for slightly more.
*Righteous Vengeance (Useless talent for PvP IMO) changed to Judge / DS crit = holy DoT (decent for Rogues, doesn’t go through repet).
*Art of War increases Judge / CS / DS damage by 5/10%, used to increase crit damage (PvP nerf.. maybe? Doesn’t really seem to be.. probable PvE buff).
*Judgement of the Wise down to 15% of base mana from 33%.
- Megaphone
October 24th, 2008 - 10:37 pm
so…ya…someone have ANY good light to shed on this?
October 24th, 2008 - 10:42 pm
Huge nerf I guess this is to stop the FotM rerolls or to make us lolret
October 24th, 2008 - 10:43 pm
Great. The JotW nerf was true.
I hate to join in and say it but it’s BC all over again. Sure, in PVE we’re not going to always be last in charts but…
These nerfs are disgusting and I do not blame anyone for quitting. This is just stupid and completely uncalled for. Gone is the burst, gone is longer stuns, gone is being a mana battery…
So we’re ( almost ) back to lolret. At least in the eyes of healers that finally oom us when they get a warrior to beat us down.
Blizzard better have something special or I’m going prot for good. I love the ret, I love it so much and I’ve played it for years. But to be nerfed to the ground so quickly after tasting what it’s like to be decent and not laughed at… Dunno. It’s depressing. And I shouldn’t get depressed over a goddamn video game.
Someone answer me this; what is left in PVP now?
October 24th, 2008 - 10:52 pm
TO THE GROUND BABY! *pulls out DK*
October 24th, 2008 - 10:53 pm
Just read from the general chat that ret pallies will also have HUGE nerfing in patch 3.0.3. I’m beginning to think ret pallies will be the least viable class AGAIN for PVE and PVP because of this nerfing. Developers should really use their heads and not waste time nerfing ret pallies anymore.
October 24th, 2008 - 10:54 pm
And so the vicious circle begins anew..
October 24th, 2008 - 11:00 pm
I canceled my sub today…sick of this crap.
October 24th, 2008 - 11:00 pm
My account expires Nov. 4th. Launch nerfs were awful. TBC was an injury. Wrath is an insult added to injury. Don’t go putting too much hope into the DKs either. They’re already a shell of their former beta glory. You spend your time watching various diseases nickle and dime your target to death. It’s all very anticlimactic. The only really viable PvP build - Unholy - has been mentioned right alongside Retribution as allegedly overpowered. I expect nerfs to DK’s days out of Wrath launch, just like Paladins got days out of 3.0 launch.
October 24th, 2008 - 11:01 pm
I don’t mind any of it… except JotW. -_-
October 24th, 2008 - 11:39 pm
I dont mind the dmg nerfs either, but the jotw nerf is a huge nerf……….I was expecting maybe 25-28% jotw nerf, not cutting it more than 50% ……….. I hope this patch dosent go live as is. Hopefully they will mess around with the numbers some more on JOTW.
October 25th, 2008 - 12:06 am
It actually makes sense now that I think of it. I hate it, but it makes sense. They buffed raid boss armor by 10%, but every pally move they nerfed is/was holy damage, which ignored armor. So I can see why they did it (tho perhaps they did too much?) but they were grossly foolish in not stating that fact.
As for the JotW massive nerf (seriously less than half?) the only 3 things I can think are 1) they are planning to greatly buff a paladins base mana (or how its calculated), or 2) they are planning a substantial replenishment buff in the near future, or 3) they have to be adding a new feature to paladins to help mana regen.
In the end I still can’t feel they are nerfing based on 70 without regard for 80 (Hi Hi early TBC again).
October 25th, 2008 - 12:35 am
Greetings
We all knew nerf incomming about our burst and it was fine ( it would make fake ret stop thinking they can rock with only three key) but Jotw ruins the day .
Hey it wont hurt Ret in pvp nor in pve “at lvl 70″ with all the mana we got from our stuff and raid buff.
But the class needs a massive mana regen to work properly in pvp. to sustain our dps
What will happen in wotlk? We will have the same stuff than a warrior / dk which means no int from our gear. So basically we will be as weak as in 2.4 against crazy purge/dispel/manaburner
But there was Jotw and an old comment from Gc saying something like “ret should dps without having mana issues for it ”
With this new build, the Jotw nerf isnt enough now to sustain our three “main” attacks . Crusader strike , divine storm and judgment . its something like 8+12+5=25% of base mana .
And i forgot all of our very uselfull spells like HoF HoJ Epuration HoP HoS repentence etc … + our amazing ” art of war ” proc which gives us an extra instant flash heal (with still a mana cost)
What is the solution now ? Divine plea? wait it s dispelable .
I m still waiting for wotlk to see if ret is still a viable spec on pvp . But i have to say this build is pretty bad .
The paladin community of wow and from this Web site cannot stay mute.
Oh and sorry for my grammar .
English isnt my native language
October 25th, 2008 - 2:21 am
Hmm, wait till they nerf all the other OP-ed classes/abilities/specs before commenting too much. It always did seem odd to me that we use AoE abilities on single targets without thinking about it (besides the GCD).
Although it seems me might be using seal of wisdom to DPS groups down now since JotW is so low…
October 25th, 2008 - 4:08 am
This is the straw that broke the camels back.
I have cancelled my subscription.
I’m tired of being lied to, led around by promises in order to get me to renew/buy expansions, only to have them yanked away the second blizzard gets my money.
If these changes are rescinded and do not make it to live, I will come back. Otherwise, its goodbye WoW. My wife already cancelled her account. Now I’ve cancelled mine. We both have mid level Warhammer characters. Guess its WAR until another really good MMO comes out.
October 25th, 2008 - 4:35 am
Don’t forget the best buff ever:
Blessing of Might (Rank 8 ) and Greater Blessing of Might (Rank 3) now increase AP by 306. (Up from 305)
-.-
October 25th, 2008 - 5:10 am
This all just makes me sick…
I felt the problem with Ret was Everything was working for once. This should break everything back to normal.
October 25th, 2008 - 7:48 am
judgment of wise are realy bugde now some time it gives 57mana other times 659mana
October 25th, 2008 - 8:16 am
Well I am through. I am not going through th frustration again. I cancelled my account and preorder.
October 25th, 2008 - 10:09 am
I for one am getting sick and tired of getting the constant nerf stick taken to us paladins. I think that everyone that plays paladins should stop playing them for 1 full year, maybe just maybe(wishful thinking) this will make Blizzard take a seriously look as to what they are doing to us.
October 25th, 2008 - 10:21 am
What is Ret’s niche in post 3.0.3? We still lack the other pvp utility that most classes bring (Healing debuff, spell interrupt, spammable CC, snare) and now we lack our only edge: Burst and infinite mana.
October 25th, 2008 - 10:45 am
Drops, Warriors dont use Whirlwind on single targets?
Seriously.
October 25th, 2008 - 10:53 am
Oh, and don’t forget this :D…
4:35 CEST - Another Paladin change, it seems that Hammer of Wrath is now only usable on enemies that have 20% health or less (Down from 35%). The tooltip of the spell wasn’t changed and it might be a bug.
October 25th, 2008 - 11:08 am
This does, at least to me, seem like a returning to the old ways. I was finally excited that I wouldn’t be judged my stereotypes by people on my server saying either “lolret” or “can’t spell retard with out ret,” but no…
The ONLY and ABSOLUTE reason for said nerfs that can come to my mind is that ‘A’ word I hate so much…Arenas. And especially when you, the developer play the game in arenas with one of the ‘arena’ classes, that doesn’t help matters.
Regardless of your opinion or not, most of this ‘balancing’ is derived from an imbalance in PvP. I’m so bloody sick to death of this crap being shoved down our throats. I play this game because it used to be fun; running through dungeons and raids killing bosses, destroying my enemies and being feared. >:D
I just now feel like that spec thats just….there, sort of a 5th wheel or an extra toe on the foot that serves no real purpose. That rant being said, I just want to be useful, not judged and most importantly, have fun again.
October 25th, 2008 - 11:08 am
The Hammer of Wrath nerf was merely bringing it in line with execute, just as the Warrior/DK versions of vengeance were balanced to the paladin version.
October 25th, 2008 - 11:27 am
Um, Seal of Blood/Martyr was outright nerfed and JoB/JoM were nerfed slightly.
October 25th, 2008 - 12:18 pm
Yeah, I don’t see where you read that blood/martyr were buffed, they got nerfed too.
October 25th, 2008 - 2:20 pm
forget lolret…R.I.P.RET
October 25th, 2008 - 2:47 pm
I heard a rumour they’re nerfing bubble too.. You cant attack while bubbled?
Think I’ll be rerolling DK now. I was 100% sure I was playing my paladin.. I didn’t see the nerfs to RV as a nerf, the dot is a buff, the burst was too high.. But they’ve nerfed ALL seal damage now? LOL
I wish they’d just fucking remove Divine Shield. Trying to balance a class that can go invuln for 12s is ridiculous. I want more controlled damage, and no 12s shield.
Also for the record: the developers adding a chance to proc seals on instants, wtf were they thinking? My burst RNG damage went through the roof. Crusader Strike Procs Command + Auto Attack Procs Command, hello 6-8k damage randomly. I AM CLAPPING FOR YOU BLIZZARD COZ YOU ARE FUCKING RETARDS
October 25th, 2008 - 6:57 pm
This nerf was done likely not to quell our dps but to nerf healers who were spec’ing ret/holy hybrids and healing raids and instances with out ever losing mana. This is honestly a repeat of pre bc when holy wasnt losing mana due to illumination procs on crit heals. So they nerfed that, but this time it’s having a horrible affect on our dps cycles. I dont even want to touch my paladin and i dont think i’m going to play it till it’s fixed. Terrible fix imo and i’m not even going to deal with it.
October 26th, 2008 - 5:27 am
omfg.. that’s so gay.. they destroyed my other character (shadowpriest) and so i rerolled a ret palli, seeing as they weren’t at the top of dps nor the bottom i guessed this would be a safe bet… so yeh.. about 8 days of in game playing for nothing.. fkn gay… i might have to just roll a mage or a rogue, seems they’ll be safe for ever